Neubia Harris Law

Neubia Harris Interview Article (Platform: Clio)

Mrs. Harris is an experienced North Carolina attorney who has been practicing law for over a decade. She has been running her own practice, which specializes in Education Law and Civil Litigation, for over three years. Her firm currently has a staff of four and is a big proponent of using integrated technology in the practice. She is a wife, a mother, and a spirited advocate. Here are some of her thoughts on technology and its future in the legal world.

Disclaimer: Please note the interview has been condensed and edited to remove natural redundancies, idiosyncrasies, and traditional pleasantries inherent to a conversation. Questions and responses may have been combined for a more concise message and format, as well as trimmed down when deemed helpful in delivering a clear message to the reader. All changes have been made with the desire to display the core message of the interviewee’s responses. Prior to the posting of this interview, the interviewee has reviewed the interview and approved the changes so as to confirm they have not to be misrepresented.

What role would you say technology plays in your firm?

Neubia: I would say that technology is imperative to what we do because we are a state-wide education practice. Often, we receive documents from clients digitally or electronically.  Additionally, we communicate with nearly all of our clients via telephone or video platforms. We can participate in Individual Education Program (“IEP”) meetings, school board meetings, and hearings via video platforms as well. Technology is imperative for us, especially now, because we are being cautious due to the COVID-19 pandemic. However, even before the pandemic started, we were receiving most of our records for our students electronically and digitally using platforms like Dropbox. Education law is a document intensive practice.  Because student records are voluminous, technology enables us to minimize the amount of paper needed to review those records and saves the unnecessary expense of trying to mail them.  Since our inception, we have attempted to maximize out utilization of technology.

As an attorney with a growing practice, what advice would you give to smaller firms who are looking to expand and grow?

Neubia: I definitely would say don’t shy away from developing an innovative practice.  I think there is a traditional way of practice that we all think of where we need to have an office, hard files, a paralegal who sits in the office, etc. However, if we have learned anything in the past year and half, it is that a traditional office environment is not always necessary. Our practice has certainly been open to alternative ways of operating. We have a virtual assistant who’s based in South Africa, and she’s phenomenal. We just recently hired a paralegal who will split her time between working in the office and working at home. There have been some studies that support the conclusion that people who are working from home are more productive and tend to work longer since there is no commute to and from work.  We are maximizing on that.  Honestly, we are moving towards becoming a virtual law firm. This will enable us to maximize technology to attract clients, meet clients, and get information from and to clients.  Don’t be afraid to step outside of the box practice law like a millennial (it’s not a bad word).

Do you think that practicing virtually is the way of the future or do you think that it will be more so relegated to smaller firms?

Neubia: It seems like it may be easier for a smaller firm to practice virtually. I have not, outside of my practice at Legal Aid, worked in big law, but I will say even Legal Aid has a ton of tech. They have attorneys who are dedicated to technology and making sure that everyone across the state can access their filing system, templates, and resources. If you have a group of people who are younger or who are not afraid of utilizing technology to their advantage, it is possible for bigger, older and/or more traditional firms to do this.  A lot of us who opened our own firms or work in small law firms did so to be a little bit flexible so that we could attend to our other obligations; be it family, aging parents or a better work life balance. To make sure that we can access our files and print documents wherever we are (e.g. a beach, a doctor’s appointment, Starbucks), is helpful for us to practice law the way we want to.

Would you say that implementing technology has substantially increased the viability and efficiency of your firm?

Neubia: Yes, absolutely. I’m not tied to the office building.  My laptop, tablet and phone are with me nearly everywhere I go. It doesn’t matter where I am, I can take a call, review a document, research case law or any number of things.

Now with that, the caveat is making sure that you stay safe, that you have your VPN, that you have your private Wi-Fi and anything else required to make sure that you’re protecting your client’s information and working in compliance with the bar’s regulations.

Being able to work from anywhere has certainly increased the profitability of my firm, while still enabling me to be the wife, mother, daughter and civically involved citizen I want to be.  I can communicate to potential clients across the state; people who probably wouldn’t have travelled to Raleigh for a consultation or even considered hiring an attorney so far from where they live. This is where we are right not. Many business and judicial functions are happening via Zoom, Google Meet, and Microsoft Teams.  As a society, we are more comfortable conducting business this way, which means that more potential clients are comfortable doing an initial consultation via video platforms. So, I do think it’s certainly increased my ability to serve people, east to west.

What kind of challenges as a firm owner, what kind of challenges do you feel you face?

Neubia: I think one of the challenges are the slow periods. As an attorney in education law summertime is naturally a slow period. The students aren’t in school, so you’ve got a little bit of a lull. Our civil litigation practice typically slows down around the winter holidays (Thanksgiving and Christmas).  By have two large primary practice areas and a few tertiary practice areas, we are able to make sure the firm continues to thrive and grow. Another challenge is, I’m the mom of a happy, healthy, and busy toddler. It is challenging balancing my biggest job, being his mom, with my other job, being their lawyer.  The challenge is  making sure that my work does not interfere with me being a mom.  I know people say it the other way around, right? Like not letting being a mother prevent me from being a successful lawyer and entrepreneur; but I don’t see it that way. Being a mom is my most important job, and everything else comes second.

To supplement that question, what would you say are the tech challenges that you face?

Neubia: If the internet goes down, which happens more than it should, in my opinion, then I am prevented from doing a lot of my work. It’s challenging that something out of my control can be such a barrier.  It can be frustrating, especially if you are not in the office, don’t have access to the hard file, or, in the case of a virtual firm, you only have a digital file.   I’ve learned to back things up.

I think another challenge is the abilities of your clients. If you’re working with clients who are inexperienced with technology or have physical or mental disabilities whereby technology is not the best method of communication, having a largely technology-based firm is a disadvantage.  For example, they may not be able to complete the intake form, make online payments or participate in video meetings.  These clients may be ready, willing and able to hire you, but may find that your procedures are too cumbersome.  We do our best to accommodate these clients by offering in person meetings (following all COVID-19 safety protocols), utilizing traditional mail, and communicating via telephone as opposed to email.  If you’re going to build a firm based on technology, just understand that there are going to be some people who prefer the traditional law firm with traditional ways of doing things.   Some people do not want to conduct business virtually.  You will either have to accommodate those people, or risk losing that clientele. 

What kind of what kind of challenges do you see affecting other, solo and boutique firms or otherwise that that you communicate? What kind of challenges do you see them kind of dealing with that you may or may not necessarily have to deal with?

Neubia: One big challenge facing solo and boutique law firms is balancing the practice of law with being a business owner. At some point for most of us, the law kind of takes a backseat and running a business and being an entrepreneur takes a front seat. People like me who are passionate about the law don’t want it to be that way. To the extent that we can, small and solo law firms source out some of the business parts of the firm that we could do, but it would be quicker and more productive to have someone with that particular experience do (e.g. accounting, technology consulting.).  Another challenge I see facing solo and small firm lawyers is that some are figuring out that they do not enjoy the practice of law.  You spend so much time becoming a lawyer, learning to practice law, and working within the legal world only to realize that it is not something you want to spend the rest of your life doing. It is a hard pill to swallow, and certainly a hard transition for many people.  However, I applaud those who pursue alternative careers in the pursuit of happiness.

With attorneys that you communicate with? Have you noticed any issues that they’ve had with technology like has like you’re currently implementing new tech solutions in your firm? Have you witnessed that be a thing that you would recommend to attorneys that are currently either overwhelmed or experiencing some of the challenges that you mentioned?

Neubia: Absolutely. I know a lot of attorneys who use CLIO.  Almost none of us are using it to its full potential.  I may mention running a report, and another attorney will say “wait, you can do that?” Or I will hear another attorney speaking about a feature they use in CLIO that I was not aware existed.  It helps to have members of the firm trained on the nuisances of your practice management software, or to consult with someone, like EsqTech, who can assist you in maximizing the technology at your disposal. You are paying for these platforms, so get the most out of them.

What role does automation play in how your firm operates?

Neubia: I think the first thing we did in terms of automation was our intake process. When a potential client calls,  we gather preliminary information and set up a workflow in CLIO Grow.  Our VA hits a button, and the intake form goes out. Once the intake form goes out, the client fills it out, and it comes back. We check it out and see if it is within our practice areas and run a conflict check.  Our VA hits another button to offer the potential client a consultation. At that point it is up to the potential client to schedule and pay for their consultation. Once they do that, it gets put on my calendar or the calendar of whoever is going to do the consultation and then we move forward. Then if they decide they want to retain us again, our VA hits a button, and the retainer goes out and they can sign digitally. Our intake process is a series of checklists based on the type of case.  The checklists are automated and save us a lot of time.

Would say that because of the increased efficiency from automating your intake you were inspired to see if you could automate other aspects, and see what kind of change that would bring, right?

Neubia: Right. Correct.

What made you choose the current platform that you’re using, which is Clo.

Neubia: Clio was what was used at the firm that I was at previously, and so it just made sense when I started my own firm to transition to something that I was already familiar with. I considered other, practice management software platforms, but I really didn’t have the time to learn them because I started sooner than I thought I was going to. In response to a natural disaster. So, I wanted to make sure that I was available ready and could go ahead and get started. I went with what I knew.

Are you glad that you stuck with it because you’re now able to do different things with it such as document automation?

Neubia: Yes, I am that I stuck with it. CLIO provides a decent discount to members of the North Carolina Bar Association.  Their support staff has been responsive to my inquiries and needs. The platform helps me manage my practice.

Do you have any comments or any thoughts that you don’t believe were addressed in the questions that I asked?

Neubia: Law firms must embrace technology because it keeps advancing.  As it advances, professionals must also advance.  Actually, here’s an interesting story. This is just incidental because I think it’s funny. When I was in high school, I went to Disney World, and they had this Disney Home of the future.  You could tell the lights to cut on and off, tell doors to open, and stuff like that. There were a bunch of gadgets in this home of the future. I was selected from the crowd to come up and play with this smart home. I was probably 16 or 17 years old.  Now, the things in that home of the future are in my home. We talk to Alexa and Siri nearly every day.  Artificial intelligence tells us the weather, that we have a package, the temperature is out of the desired range, that someone is at our door. The stuff that was extraordinary at Disney world twenty years ago is commonplace now.  It just goes to show that the things that we think are out of this world could very well be the new norm in a few years.